Hello Linux community.
I’d like to take a moment to explain what I hope will be a simple concept (so really it’s more of a reminder) that everyone should say least know and understand.
Not everyone (myself included) learns best by RTFM. Some of us need a guiding hand or to watch a video instead. It’s not that we’re lazy or don’t like reading, it’s just that it doesn’t work efficiently enough.
RTFM makes more sense in a professional context. I don’t expect anybody to read anything unless 1 they want to or 2 they are being paid to
Saying RTFM in a hobby or recreational space is just being an asshole for no good reason
Meh… There have been a whole lot of braindead “pls do it for me” posts going around since the influx of windows refugees.
I’m not one to be a prick about answering questions to help out, and we all start somewhere, but “help me get steam and my LLM working on Kali linux” where ppl get in way over their heads is becoming a real problem. Worse, they will call the linux community toxic for suggesting they need more fundamentals first.
I interpret the post title as a general “try your best, and come to us when you’re stuck”.
i’m not seeing that stuff much but i do believe you
Counterpoint: Aside from disabilities which specifically impact reading, why wouldn’t someone want to read when it comes to their hobbies? A hobby is something one intentionally devotes time to, typically unpaid and nonprofessionally, because they enjoy it and they want to learn more about it. A large amount of my enjoyment is derived from learning more about the things I enjoy, so not wanting to consume that information makes no sense to me.
I can understand, for example, gaming as a hobby and wanting quick answers if one is jumping ship from Windows to Linux. Linux isn’t the hobby there; just a means to an end. I’d still argue the gamer should develop some level of proficiency with their underlying OS. Otherwise it’s like having trail riding as a hobby without any knowledge or tools to patch a tube, tension a chain or tighten a bolt. One might end up in a situation where they can’t just get an instant answer. Investing a little time in the mechanics could keep a short ride from turning into a long trudge out with a bike over the shoulder.
In the context of “Linux”, broadly, as a hobby - what even is that hobby if it isn’t making an honest effort to learn broadly about various tools, the kernel, scripting and programming languages, and so forth? Linux always struck me as a hobby for people who collect hobbies. Or people that have “learning” as a hobby. It’s why, while I’ll probably never work a day of my life in IT, I know how to do some basic SQL queries, hit an API and parse the JSON, do a little scripting in Bash and Python, utilize a load of CLI tooling much more efficiently than any Windows GUI I’ve ever used, and so on. I’ll never know it all but part of the fun is trying anyway.
just because you find it fun doesn’t mean everyone does. i know a couple Linux users who see Linux as a worthwhile chore: boring, frustrating, annoying, but ultimately worthwhile to get away from Microsoft or to gain functionality Windows does not have.
I agree that Linux is also often a step to the actual hobby: gaming, self-hosting, photography, audio production. I empathize with someone reluctant to learn the ins and outs of Unix file ownership when they are just trying to make beats without paying Microsoft. Sure the knowledge is rewarding, but i can’t blame a person for not grokking it the first time when on the surface is seems pointless
If someone is making an effort to learn and doesnt take my time for granted i’m happy to help them.
Also man pages are usually good but lots of software half-asses them these days
“It’s not a professional’s job to read the manuals they need to know for their job unless I specifically tell them to” is an interesting take. A really stupid one but interesting non-the-less…
I think you misinterpreted their message. Their argument is that it’s an expectation that the professional RTFM (more accurately, to have already done so) which shouldn’t carry over to hobbyists. At least not as strictly. Put another way, “The certified Toyota technician needs to have the fancy book learnin’ while the weekend wrencher or shadetree mechanic shouldn’t be held to the same standard.”
I disagree insofar as, short of inaccessible resources (sadly becoming more common in my automotive example) or a lack of time and money, there’s no reason a hobbyist shouldn’t strive to educate themselves and achieve professional level of excellence. So long as they enjoy it, anyway. That’s really the point of a hobby.
the problem was that nobody paid ooops@feddit.org to read any of this